Amnesty International, famous for their efforts defending the human rights of terrorists and criminals everywhere, are now, with the full support of the Source, weighing in on the subject of TASER use. The premise is that TASERS are the primary factor in hundreds of deaths among those unfortunate enough to have been Tased. The reason for the use of force is conveniently sidestepped in all but the most sensational of cases.
Over 200 people have died within a two-hour window of being hit with a TASER. However, medical examiners (aka the experts) determined TASER use to have been the primary or secondary cause in only 23 of those cases.
Police officers reside on the bleeding edge between the mostly safe, orderly society we all enjoy on a daily basis and a Third World environment where people behave as animals. Every duty shift is an act of courage for an officer. The men and women in uniform have a right and a duty to maintain order and protect themselves and others through the use of force when necessary.
TASERs save lives. Hundreds and possibly thousands who otherwise would have been shot with a conventional firearm are still alive today because the officer involved opted for a TASER instead. Nor should officers be obliged to risk their own safety by engaging in hand-to-hand tactics when there is an alternative. How can this be ambiguous for AI, the Source or anyone else?
If you’re worried a police officer may hit you with a TASER, here’s the bottom line. Don’t commit crimes, and if an officer issues you an order, by all means comply. That’s pretty much it.
Jon Jegglie
This article appears in Feb 21-27, 2008.
MAKE LOCAL JOURNALISM HAPPEN
Republish our articles for free, online or in print, under a Creative Commons license.
I have often agreed with Jegglie in the past but I think he misses the reason many of us are concerned about growing taser use. Too often, tasers are used, and we’ve all seen this on TV, when NO use of force was required. An inebriated, handcuffed, shackled, 100 pound female who is giving a sober (presumably) 280 pound male officer verbal abuse only, is a piss poor excuse for taser use.
Police are resorting to taser use in situations clearly not appropriate as an alternative to deadly force. A recent event on TV showed a police officer repeatedly telling someone to “shut up” when the ‘offender’ continued to ask the officer, “what the hell is the matter with you?” The officer tazed the person repeatedly over and over while the “suspect” was incapacitated on the ground, clearly out of it. Was something just short of deadly force required or appropriate here? Hell no!
The reality is, we are putting an instrument of torture, and the means to get revenge for insulting but petty issues, into the hands of folks who are often the true assholes inciting the situation to begin with. When I was pursuing my degree in Psychology, early on, I was surprised to find out that the psychological profile of your average crook was almost exactly the same as your average cop. Some of this profile go one way, others the opposite. In essence, we have anti-social people ‘protecting’ us from the other anti-social folks. With this in mind, police should have to justify the use of tasers with the same scrutiny of post investigation and other restrictions as deadly force.
After someone is dead, it is nearly impossible to determine if the heart stopped because of a recently induced electrical shock. If there is no statistical correlation between tasers and a quick death, then just as many would be dead within two hours from eating a corn beef sandwich after an altercation with the police. I doubt that is the case.
If a police officer uses a taser and no justification for that use is apparent to a reasonable person, that officer should be charged with assault by a deadly weapon and be prosecuted accordingly.
What happens to an ordinary citizen if some asshole cop is shooting off his mouth and you taser him to get him to shut the hell up? You would be charged with assault. Assault is assault, no matter who does it.
The problem with tasers being in the hands of police is having tasers in the hands of police.
Police use these ‘new and exciting’ toys to sadistically abuse people at least as often as they are used as an alternative to deadly force. Cops see tasers as a method to ‘get even’ for what they perceive as slights during arrests, giving out tickets, etc.
Giving anti-social loners (cops) a dangerous and sadistic methodology to abuse people simply means that they will then abuse the privilege.
Tasers kill people. That means cops kill people.
We should prosecute all cops that use tasers in a none life threatening situation. It is the moral equivalent of rape.
Jegglie needs to step into the real world. Police are a neccesary evil and nothing more. Police don’t put their life on the line every day. A cops first rule is to cover his own ass. If that means you die while he is cowering behind his cruiser, tough shit for you.
Wise up Jegglie.
“After someone is dead, it is nearly impossible to determine if the heart stopped because of a recently induced electrical shock.”
That is a crucial point. If somebody dies as the result of his heart going into atrial fibrillation, it leaves no trace that would be detectable in an autopsy. The truth is we do not know, and have no way of knowing, how many deaths have been caused by Tasers.
Speaking of Tasers, Bulletin reporter Cindy Powers did a story about them the other day and volunteered to let herself be Tased so she could describe what it felt like. (In two words: Not good.) That was an extremely foolish action on her part, IMO. I definitely wouldn’t do it now and I don’t think I would do it even if I were Cindy’s age.
Cindy’s story was clearly pro-Taser and I strongly suspect it was done in response to my story raising questions about Tasers. For example, the lede told about a Bend PD officer using a Taser on a suspect who was brandishing a shotgun. I don’t think any rational person would deny it was appropriate to use a Taser in such circumstances. But situations like that are the exception, not the rule, when Tasers are used.
I’m not saying the Bend PD or any other local law enforcement agency has abused Tasers; I have no evidence that they have. But the potential for abuse is there and should not be casually dismissed.
HBM
Saw the Bull article where the reporter was tazed. Did you catch the look on the face of the officer tazing the woman as she writhed in pain? His smile of amusement/enjoyment says it all, I think. This is a weapon–less fatal than a half dozen rounds of 9mm lead, but still an extremely violent response that in many cases appears to be over-reaching and unnecessary.
Bonnie–
‘Jegglie needs to step into the real world. Police are a neccesary evil and nothing more. Police don’t put their life on the line every day. A cops first rule is to cover his own ass. If that means you die while he is cowering behind his cruiser, tough shit for you.’
Obviously, you have issues with the police, but you are painting with an awfully broad brush when you make statements like these. I would posit that because of your attitude and the attitude of like-minded individuals, the police ARE putting their lives on the line every day. When things go wrong for them there are always people to second guess and play the blame game. Bad profession when you are considered ‘evil’ just because you hold that job.
If you understand the psychological profile of the average cop…which is identical to the common criminal, you have issues with them. All you have to do, is ask yourself, “who wants to be a Cop?” If you are honest, the answer explains it all. The vast majority of police have an anti-social ‘us and them’ attitude. Most police do not socialize with non-cops. They consider all non-cops to be ‘the enemy.’ It matters not to the police whether you have committed a crime or not, only if an arrest can be made that looks reasonable on paper. My husband was once arrested and charged with burglary in the first degree for attempting to get back his stolen property from the thieves that had the property, after we had filed a theft report with the sheriff. His arrest was thrown out of court. When my husband asked this detective why he had been arrested, the asshole replied, “because I can.” My husband had a concealed weapons permit, which he still has, and it took a lawyer and a court order and three months to force the asshole to return his pistol. By the way, the thieves who took the several thousands of dollars worth of our property were never arrested and allowed to keep it. The police informed us they couldn’t find them, even though my husbands supposed burglary occurred at their residence and the crooks were interviewed by this same detective in the presence of our stolen property. You want to give these folks a taser?
Do you remember the unarmed man in NY that was shot 49 times by three or four cops who even stopped to reload and shoot the now dead guy some more? You want to give these folks a taser?
Do you ever watch a chase on TV and observe when the guy throws himself on the ground in surrender how eight or ten cops pile on top of him beating the shit out of the guy with fists and batons? You want to give these folks a taser?
You want Drew Petersen to have a taser? Do you want Bobby Cutts to have a taser? The police have the highest criminal activity per capita of any profession in the US. More crime than carpenters. More crime than auto mechanics. More crime than meat cutters. More crime than grocery clerks. More crime than any group, second only to full time professional thieves.
You are damn right I have issues with cops.
Jegglie’s “Don’t commit crimes and do as you are told and you are guaranteed to remain taser free,” is excruciatingly naive. Was the notorious, “don’t tase me, bro.” incident one of an alternative to deadly force? Four officers on top of of one college student whose presumed crime was taunting John Kerry. According to Jegglie, these officers only choice was to tase or shoot. How ridiculous! Jegglie also fails to understand, as Bonnie points out, many who are arrested have committed no crime. They are arrested because they can be. Shoot or tase these folks? Ridiculous!
Jegglie fails to see that in many, many cases, tasers are excessive force, not an alternative to deadly force. Therein lies the rub. What are police actually using tasers for? The reasonable observer comes to the conclusion that tasers are often used as ac means for disgruntled police officers to get a little sadistic revenge for what they consider an affront to their “above the law, power and control issues.” Police have the highest number of “control freaks,” of any social or professional group in the country. Is it any wonder that they abuse tasers?
Any sane person that is paying attention, knows that police are over zealous in the use of tasers. Is that dangerous? The preponderance of evidence indicates that is so. The sadistic zeal of police needs serious curbing.
Bottom line: Police should be charged with using excessive force when the use of tasers is not justified as an alternative to deadly force.
My older brother was involved in a taser incident. He is seventy years old, stooped, barely walks with the assist of a cane, because of advanced osteoarthritis. He was driving down a road in Southern California, minding his own business, when a police cruiser lighted up, siren blaring, and pulled him over. The policeman, yelling at the top of his voice, ordered my brother to put his hands in the air, exit the vehicle, lie face down on the asphalt, with his hands behind him. A technical impossibility for my brother. He did manage to open the door and slide out onto the street, but remained standing, as to lie down would seriously compromise his physical condition. He attempted to explain to the officer that he was disabled and could not comply with the order to lie down. The officer tasered him. When my brother fell, he struck his head against the running board of the truck, almost completely removing his right ear, cracking a vertebrae in his neck and he now has an erratic heartbeat. It required 17 stitches to reattach his ear. His crime? Not obeying a policeman’s command and driving a truck that vaguely matched the description of a truck wanted in an armed robbery. The armed robbery suspects were two young black males, my brother is a white senior male.
My question for Jegglie is: Did this situation warrant the use of a taser as an alternative to deadly force? If a crippled up man doesn’t comply with an order to “bite the dust,” for obvious reasons, should he be shot dead? My brother sued this police force and won a settlement. The officer was given a month off with pay and continues to “serve and protect” his community. But that is not the issue.
The issues are: Are tasers dangerous? My brother thinks so. Are tasers used inappropriately? My brother thinks so. Should the inappropriate and indiscriminate use of tasers be curtailed? We should all think so. Is the current indiscriminate use of tasers excessive force? This is a decision our society needs to decide. Pronto!
Did you see the recent video of 300 pound female police officer repeatedly ordering a paralyzed man in a wheel chair to stand up, so that he could be more conveniently searched? When the man refused, for obvious reasons, this brave officer tipped the wheel chair forward and dumped the man on his face. Why she didn’t taser this paralyzed man into standing up, is anybody’s guess.
Wayne: That’s atrocious. Is your brother going to sue the ass off the police department? He definitely should.
Jegglie not only misses the boat, he fell off the pier on this one. Ordinarily, I find myself in the opposite corner from H. Bruce. This shows you should never count someone out, they just might surprise you.
Not all cops are bad. However, enough of them abuse this privelage society gives them to cause serious concern. Unbridled taser use is clearly an important issue. There is no question that the police are using these dangerous devices well beyond their supposed mandate as a humane alternative to deadly force.
It is my observation that the primary use of tasers has become one of a petty, “I’ll teach you!” practice rather than the intended use, as we’ve seen, all too routinely, on our TV’s.
These ‘tools’ are too dangerous to use this indiscriminately. It is obviously excessive force in a large number of instances that we know about. How many events go unreported? There can be no question people are dying. Jegglie’s cavalier lack of concern for those killed by this practice is loathsome in the extreme. Perhaps he will ‘wake up’ when his grandmother is tasered for loudly objecting to a parking ticket and she falls and bashes her head against the sidewalk. What the hell, just another routine taser death, better than shooting her, right Jegglie? Cops need to find another way to get their jollies.
As for HBM…please grab this issue like the bulldog you can be…and run, run like the wrath of hell itself, with it.
Whenever someone says the รข if you have nothing to hideรข ย line, immediately accuse them of having a swastika tattooed on their genitalia รข ” if they say they donรข โขt, then surely they shouldnรข โขt mind dropping their pants to prove it.
Where do I start?
1. Charlie Swecker: The “Don’t tase me bro guy” refused to leave the arena. Doesn’t matter if they were justified in asking him to leave, he disobeyed an order from officers of the law. Then he engaged in physical confrontation and resisted arrest.
2. Bonnie Kohler: WOW! And conservatives are supposedly the ones with paranoia issues. Seriously. You need help. Would you please inform me as to how many chiropractors, artists, office professionals or (insert your occupation here) go to work armed with a 40 S&W. Damn straight the police risk their lives to serve and protect your ass. And I’m sure you’ll still call 911 the next time you require the services of this “necessary evil”.
3. Ten Bears: Exactly who is it that has something to hide? I was determined that when you chimed in I would not respond but I admit it, you got me when you falsely abused my character. That said, I’ll show you mine if you show me yours. Perhaps you have your REAL NAME tatooed on yours.
Though officers are expected to conform to a higher standard of conduct, Police departments are a slice of society at large. As such there are going to be bad people do bad things from time to time. My apologies for not making clear my belief that those individuals be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. HOWEVER, the remainder (vast majority) of the officers should have this effective tool at their disposal. Officers owe it to themselves, the suspects, the public, and their families to control situations they face. There is no way to know how or when an encounter will turn bad. What if the “Don’t tase me” had a knife and had made the stage, attacking John Kerry in the process? Likely as not these same people complaining about police not doing their job.
“HOWEVER, the remainder (vast majority) of the officers should have this effective tool at their disposal.”
I don’t think sensible people would disagree with that, Jon. But there need to be clear rules for when and how Tasers should be used and consequences for police officers who violate those rules. And a more serious concern than bad cops misusing Tasers, IMO, are good cops who are persuaded by the industry PR that the Taser is a completely harmless device and can be used indiscriminately.
Jegglie: What the hell does going to work armed with a .40 SW have to do with the issue, or any issue? Does that make cops commit crimes more than other professions? Every where I go I’m armed with a .45 Sig auto. And Jon, well over a hundred thousand concealed gun permits in a state of a little over 3 million indicates a hell of a lot of us are going to work armed. So what? The ordinary citizen holds greater risk than police. An ordinary citizen is far more likely to be attacked…than are cops…the bad guys know the cops are armed. Am I supposed to be impressed because a cop packs a gun? Another point, private citizens who carry guns have a much lower criminal rate than do cops who carry guns. Blather that one away.
I can’t speak for Bonnie, but I don’t call 911 under any circumstances. Why add grief to misery?
As for ‘don’t tase me, bro,’ not obeying the order of an, “officer of the law,” these were private security guards, not police. Does a cop have the right to curtail your freedom of speech? That was done to shut him up and for no other reason. Asshole Kerry has no more right to speak than anyone.
Apparently, if you were given any unjustified or ridiculous order, as long as it came from a “minion of justice,” you would obey it. Have you ever heard the expression, “obsequious ass?” Just curious.
Jegglie: I’ve been certified by professionals as not being paranoid. Can you truthfully say the same about your egotistical sneering delusional misconceptions?
To the delusional, the realistic appear paranoid. This simple metric explains your obvious confusion.
What the hell does packing a gun have to do with sadistic anti-social behavior? I pack a gun and I’m a model citizen in every respect, including not being deluded about a class of people you apparently know almost nothing about.
You might consider confining your snide comments to issues that you are familiar with.
I would find this Jegglie’s naive delusions a little more palatable if he wasn’t quite so quick on the sneer trigger. To refer to someone who has a collection of bad experiences as being paranoid, when they appear to be more one of wisdom born of experience, which more accurately should be called intelligence. Because this Jegglie may not learn from experience doesn’t mean it’s not a desirable attribute in others.
The issue with Jegglie’s comments appears to one of his gross misunderstanding about the psychological nature, attitudes, social perspectives, criminal behavior and collective group angst of everyday cops. Were he to get a real grip on these issues, he would not, presumably, be so anxious to have all these taser parties, where cops tase people with all the nonchalant aplomb of urinating on a bush alongside a back road.
The issues are: Are Tasers dangerous? The answer is: Absolutely!
The issues are: Are cops using these devices capriciously?: The answer is: Absoluetly!
The issues are: Is taser use way too often excessive force? The answer is: Absolutely!
The issues are: Is this a situation that needs drastic and immediate overhaul? The answer is: Absolutely!
The issues are: Should a moratorium on these dangerous devices use be temporairaly enacted until these issues are resolved? The answer is: Absolutely!
Jegglie, your depiction of the “don’t tase me, Bro.” situation was highly inaccurate and grossly distorted. They had him pinned to the ground BEFORE they tased him, not after. At that point there was no reason to tase him other than to shut him up. You really need to stop spinning like a cheap top on holiday.
And Jegglie, if four security guards, who have a skinny college student pinned down on the floor, cannot exert command and control over that individual without the use of a taser, we are all in deep shit, you included.
Jegglie: “Please inform me how many (insert occupation) go to work with a .40 SW?”
Well, Jegster, a hell of a lot of us do. Far, far more of us do than the total number of cops in this state. At last count in Oregon, the number of CHL’s was way over a hundred thousand. I sincerely doubt that your cop buddies total cluster is in those numbers, more like a few hundred.
You come off as a cop ‘wanna be’ whose opinions are clouded by your reverence for a shiny Sam Browne belt, or that .40 SW you are so taken with, instead of an informed citizen. Your position is one of denial of the real issue, while being a little quick to label others as paranoid. Perhaps it is you that is paranoid in your apparent denial of reality and are blinded by your sycophantic zeal for all things cop shop.
The abuse of tasers is not some infrequent random event, like you ignorantly claim in your feeble attempts to marginalize the issue. This excessive force abuse is commonplace. Should it be? A lot of us think not.
Jegglie, one calls 911 primarily for medical assistance. What is the urgency to call a cop? By the time they arrive, the situation is over. Police are primarily garbage collectors. They come along after the fact, to clean up the mess. When was the last time you can recall when anyone was ‘protected’ by a cop? Common sense indicates the protection of one’s self is our own responsibility. There is almost never a cop there when you need one. So, if deadly force is required, you must supply it yourself. The bad guys are notorious for not loitering around, oiling their weapons, having a smoke, patiently waiting for the cops to arrive, before they do their business with you.
Jegglie, you need to take a class in “Wise Up. 101”
Just a couple of items on the taseing issue. In the Bulletin article the author did state that she did not believe she was in any condition to obey any type of a verbal command while being tased. On the “real cop shows” yelling commands during taseing is pretty common. Now that is television land so how true or prevalent I have no idea. Oregon Department of Corrections will use tasers during certain incidences, but not very often. During training an officer will be “tased” themselves, so not an unknown experience for a corrections officer and I imageine the same for police.
Myself, if I had a choice would just rahter not be bothered, but tased is probably better than gun shot. As far as the police go, some are good some are bad, just a slice of people (I think I saw that written above also). I do agree that taseing should not be used lightly, which I think this whole thing was about.
since when should citizens be afriad of law enforcement? when we are pulled over for speeding we’re asked to put our hands on the wheel, for fear if we don’t we’ll be shot. police officer have a tough job, and tasers are an effective way to control the uncontrolable, but they can’t stop people on pcp. they can’t stop people who wear a lot of clothing to block the stingers.
while it’s a perfect solution, it’s a use of force that must be used responsibly or the image of the officer will be ruined when used imporperly.
For gtk and kevo10: Thank you. It seems that you both have a reasonable perspective. It’s refreshing to see something other than the ‘police are evil, out of control maniacs’ attitude that persists on this website.
Officers go out and put their lives on the line EVERYDAY and the TASER allows them to protect themselves (which they owe to themselves, their families and the public) as well as protect the law abiding citizens that could easily be harmed by an out of control offender. Of course some police are bad… there are bad barbers, accountants, doctors, nurses, lawyers, etc. but that certainly is not a label that applies to all the people in any of these groups.
TASERs absolutely need to be monitored and used wisely. Any officer that is irresponsible and abusive with the tool should be punished, just like the baton, gun and fist. It seems like common sense to most people so why is it so hard to understand here?
At least the guy was not a coward. He said his piece. He created some civil disobidence. He did not go gently into that good night.
The rest of you. Kiss his ass.
I like you Jon but I am going to have to dissagree with you on taser use. Combating a lethal threat with other than lethal force is just plain stupid. By introducing the taser they are offering the offenders a non lethal alternative to what really needs to be done to alot of them. I’m not saying shoot all people who argue with the police but if someone is brandishing a knive and running at an officer they need to die or they are likely to hurt someone else in the future.
Until they find something other than tasers that can help augment the non lethal side of the house, I feel they are a necessary comodity.