This week’s letter comes from Lolly Champion who takes us through health reform by the numbers. Thanks, Lolly. We agree that the absolute dysfunctionality of the system seems to be getting lost in the all shouting about socialism. Stop by our office, 704 NW Georgia, this week for your winner’s booty, a bag of Strictly Organic coffee. Toasty!
STOP HEALTH CARE REFORM
If you believe:
* that it is ok that the USA ranks 44th in infant mortality, 50th in life expectancy;
* that it is ok to spend $6,714 per person for health care while France, Sweden, Spain, Switzerland & Britain spend on average $3,500 per person and receive a higher standard of care;
* that it is ok that in the last eight years insurance premiums have risen 78% & wages rose 19%;
* that it is ok for American Health Care to be based on reaction to illness, not prevention and early detection;
* that it is ok for those 65 and older, veterans and members of Congress to have government health care coverage but it is denied to all others;
* that it is ok for you to have health coverage but you would deny the millions of Americans without access the right to have affordable health care;
* that it is ok that for-profit insurers can deny coverage to those with pre-existing conditions;
* that it is ok that 62% of all bankruptcies in ’07 were linked to medical expenses;
* that it is ok to not consider how our children and grandchildren will get care if we don’t act to reform health care now; AND
* that our congress is either too dumb, too influenced by lobby-dollars or too afraid of the right wing fanatics to pass BI-PARTISAN HEALTH CARE REFORM and it is ok that America remains the only industrial nation without coverage for all our citizens then
STOP HEALTH CARE REFORM NOW!
Lolly Champion
This article appears in Aug 20-26, 2009.
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In the first place, a great deal of the expense in American health care is due to lack of tort reform. A surgeon must come up with $200,0000.00 for malpratice insurance before he can even hang out his shingle. And then, 1/3 of all the surgerys he performs goes to pay for malpractice insurance.
Secondly, one of the reasons as to why health insurance is so high is because of no competition between the States, and the insane requirements that States like Oregon have in place for one to be covered.
Next, none of the national health care systems you are adoring is working. ALL of them are running waiting lists for elective surgerys such as hip replacements, and even cancer treatment. ALL are running huge deficits, and are either going to have to raise taxes, or cut services even further. Additionally, ALL are asking their citizens to purchase private insurance if they are able while still paying the taxes necessary. In the case of Japan, and some European countries, they have a negative population replacement rate, and the system will collapse within 10 to 15 years.
When you speak of the grandchildren, are you just as concerned that you will be saddling them with an unpayable debt just to satisfy your desires?
Now, if you want a “bipartisan” bill, and it is obvious that the left does so just so they can later blame the right when the system fails, are you willing to consider some of the proposals being presented by the “right” such as tort reform, health savings accounts, etc.?
The Democrats in Congress won’t. Maybe you should write, and tell them that you want a true bipartisan bill. Not just one where the Republicans bow to the wishes of the Democrats.
BTW Ms. Champion, or Mr. Flowers,
Those 65, and older, and the Vets, paid for, or earned, their medical coverage.
Have you? Have those on welfare?
These statistics show that intelligence and ethics are unequally distributed across the World.
Kenneth…. thanks for your input but you clearly know nothing about international healthcare systems. The WHO ranked the US system 37 in the world – maybe they’re just dang librils tryin’ t’bring the US down in a flurry of Socialistic Communism and this is their motive… or maybe the US system just sucks…. hmmmmm, it sucks.
As to the primary writer’s “desires” – statistics were prominent in the letter, desires were prominent in yours.
Can’t help but agree with you that Tort reform is long overdue… but with all those lawyers in Congress and the Senate, how likely do you think that is? And doesn’t American (ridiculous) Tort just reflect the “it must be someone else’s fault” attitude (like toddlers) of the American people?
And by the way:
This smacks of a set up for some more ad hominem agruments… let’s stick to reason and logic… a person’t argument is not more right or more wrong because they have paid Medicare deductions.
“Those 65, and older, and the Vets, paid for, or earned, their medical coverage.
Have you?”
written by Kenneth , August 19, 2009
”
BTW Ms. Champion, or Mr. Flowers,
Those 65, and older, and the Vets, paid for, or earned, their medical coverage.
Have you? Have those on welfare?”
The entire ‘death panel’ slander is based on the idea that there would be someone in government making a determination about the value of someone’s life–would it be ‘worth’ it to give them medical treatment that they need. Someone would decide–ration–the health care that they might require.
Kenneth, too, is willing to make a determination about who gets what. Rationing health care to those he determines are worth it.
Wait–they earned it because they survived to 65–ran a motor pool at Fort Jennings for three years in the 1950’s–were not on welfare? Yeah, I guess that’s fair.
Steerpike says:
Kenneth…. thanks for your input but you clearly know nothing about international healthcare systems. The WHO ranked the US system 37 in the world – maybe they’re just dang librils tryin’ t’bring the US down in a flurry of Socialistic Communism and this is their motive… or maybe the US system just sucks…. hmmmmm, it sucks.”
Guess you missed the article in another response where I posted how the WHO does it rankings, and what it uses for its statistics.
The WHO is highly favorable ot a national health care system, and it is highly prejudiced against ours. For instance, in other countries malpratice lawsuits are not allowed, however, the cost of malpractice litigation is counted in the cost of healthcare for the US.
“As to the primary writer’s “desires” – statistics were prominent in the letter, desires were prominent in yours.”
LOL, guess your reading comprehension has gone the way of others.
“Can’t help but agree with you that Tort reform is long overdue… but with all those lawyers in Congress and the Senate, how likely do you think that is? And doesn’t American (ridiculous) Tort just reflect the “it must be someone else’s fault” attitude (like toddlers) of the American people?”
Republicans are for tort reform, Democrats will not allow it.
The health care debate is all about personal responsibility v letting someone else pay for it. Guess which side you are on, hmmmmm.
“And by the way:
This smacks of a set up for some more ad hominem agruments… let’s stick to reason and logic… a person’t argument is not more right or more wrong because they have paid Medicare deductions.”
It becomes a point of contention when Congress is planning on taking 500 BILLION from the medicare program to pay for the “public option”.
It also becomes a point of contention when one system is “robbed” to pay for the benefits of one who pays nothing into the system.
Nothing ad hominem about it. Just your “strawman” argument.
Well, he’s got me beat, that’s all I can say. I can’t think of a single argument he hasn’t misread, misinterpreted or ignored already. Don’t know how such a genius hasn’t been head hunted by a big firm… I know I’d like to head hunt him!!!! LOL
So… Kenny Ken Kenneth Kennibunkport Kenniwick man I bid you adieu because I’m bored with you
Yup ah agree with the various Kens on here!
That WHO wuz jest out to make the good ol’ USA’s healthcare disaster look bad! So… they fudged the numbers to make us come out 37th (in 2000! – we’re probably 40th now as things have hardly gotten better under Junior Bush) – dats what I jes don’ git… why do all those international bodies try so hard to make this great country look so bad? Why don’t the United Nations like us? Why don’t the International War Crimes courts like us? After all we done for everyone and all our freedoms!
I mean, there IS NO WAY and I mean NO WAY Americans would be dumb enough to pay more for healthcare than any other nation on the planet and settle for 37th best!!!! No way!! USA!! USA!!! USA!! Sorry, got carried away there… LOL.
Now here’s what I think… private enterprise in healthcare got us to 37th best well all we need to really improve, and get to oh, I don’t know… 27th best IS MORE PRIVATE ENTERPRISE…. Who taught me that???? Why Ronald Reagan of course… he taught me that no matter what the question is – the answer is MORE PRIVATE ENTERPRISE….
Long ago I asked you to read this article, and obviously none of you did:
http://smartgirlnation.com/2009/06/01/popular-ranking-unfairly-misrepresents-the-us-health-care-system/
Here is another one you might want to read:
http://www.ncpa.org/pub/ba596/
Now, I don’t know if any of you watch Lou Dobbs, hwever, he has been doing a comparison of the top universal systems in the world. The one factor that becomes clear is that all of them are failing. More, and more, they are having to rely on PRIVATE insurance to cover their needs. British Columbia in Canada ia rationing surgeries, etc. France is running a 12-15 Billion dollar deficit every year, and is requiring more private insurance carriers for those who can afford it.
You people are stuck in such a bubble you could not find your way out with a hot stick.
BTW, a recent report has found that the life expectancy in the US has risen again. 75.7 years for men, and 80.5 years for women.
Steerpike says:
Well, he’s got me beat, that’s all I can say. I can’t think of a single argument he hasn’t misread, misinterpreted or ignored already. Don’t know how such a genius hasn’t been head hunted by a big firm… I know I’d like to head hunt him!!!! LOL
So… Kenny Ken Kenneth Kennibunkport Kenniwick man I bid you adieu because I’m bored with you”
Hey, your welcome to come “hunt” me any time you feel you have the balls to do so. I’ll even give you my address.
Having said that, it is better for you to quit while you are behind, and you are obviously behind since you have posted nothing that refutes what I have said just as the others before you have not.
Finally, the Real Man, Swipies
“Hey, your welcome to come “hunt” me any time you feel you have the balls to do so. I’ll even give you my address”
At last! The final piece of the Swipies “Character”… he (it) starts by calling us all liars, then idiots, then cowards, then morons, then drones blah blah… then he tells us all about his 3.6 GPA now it’s the thinly disguised threat of physical violence….. yawn, what a bore, ZZZZZZZZZZZ, how much can you bench, are your arms big?
Relax Pooper! He’s not threatening you… it’s just that for obvious reasons he’s never heard of “head hunting” before and he thought YOU were threatening HIM!! You misunderestimated him!
And….. he beat you in ALL the arguments you had with him… he beat me too… and all the other “lefties”. He is our Supreme Leader, Qwim Ill Junk.
Steerpike says: ,
Finally, the Real Man, Swipies
“Hey, your welcome to come “hunt” me any time you feel you have the balls to do so. I’ll even give you my address”
At last! The final piece of the Swipies “Character”… he (it) starts by calling us all liars, then idiots, then cowards, then morons, then drones blah blah… then he tells us all about his 3.6 GPA now it’s the thinly disguised threat of physical violence….. yawn, what a bore, ZZZZZZZZZZZ, how much can you bench, are your arms big?
Your buddy Shortall seems to think so, lol
BTW, my invitation to meet with all of you for a face to face conversation still stands. Then you can call me names in person. Think you can do it?
Party Pooper says:
Relax Pooper! He’s not threatening you… it’s just that for obvious reasons he’s never heard of “head hunting” before and he thought YOU were threatening HIM!! You misunderestimated him!
And….. he beat you in ALL the arguments you had with him… he beat me too… and all the other “lefties”. He is our Supreme Leader, Qwim Ill Junk.”
Talking to yourself again?
Remember now, Miller won’t respond to you since you don’t have what it takes to use your real name, lol
If Steerpike had meant “head hunt” in the context of a large firm he would have put the remark in quotation marks. However, since his intent was obvious so is his backing off the comment.
And, perhaps you could enlighten me as to which argument with me you have “won”.
As an example, I defined “elite”, and “modern liberal” in “Buffalos Behaving Badly”. However, since it did not fit with your agenda, and since you obviously had no legitimate response, you decided that I had not answered your questions just as you did in another thread on religion. It is a common tactic you seem to employ when you have no answers.
No insight, no self knowledge, ignorance coupled with arrogance and aggression…. the superlative Conservative…
“Then you can call me names in person”
This, from the guy who has been calling everyone else on here a liar for a month before moving onto other names… What larks, Pip!
I’ll have to say no to the “date” Swipeace, you’re a scary dude
Sweatpiece said:
“As an example, I defined “elite”, and “modern liberal” in “Buffalos Behaving Badly”. However, since it did not fit with your agenda, and since you obviously had no legitimate response, you decided that I had not answered your questions just as you did in another thread on religion. It is a common tactic you seem to employ when you have no answers”
Yeah, dude, you’re right.
And we’re still waiting for definitions of “modern liberal”, “Classical Liberal” and “Elitist” from other arguments……
Steerpike, Pooper and Cramer… if you ever come back!!!
Try as I did I was unable to find any rule or convention stating that “head hunting” must be written in parentheses so it is not confused with that well known Bend activity head hunting (the acquisition of people’s heads for religious or decorative purposes). Have you guys not realized yet that you are dealing with someone with serious psychological problems? And I don’t just mean the (laughable) libertarian leanings.
Thanks R…. I know he’s nuts but it’s fun making him research all his dumb answers
List of things Conservatives think are quite OK
“that it is ok that the USA ranks 44th in infant mortality, 50th in life expectancy;
* that it is ok to spend $6,714 per person for health care while France, Sweden, Spain, Switzerland & Britain spend on average $3,500 per person and receive a higher standard of care;
* that it is ok that in the last eight years insurance premiums have risen 78% & wages rose 19%;
* that it is ok for American Health Care to be based on reaction to illness, not prevention and early detection;
* that it is ok for those 65 and older, veterans and members of Congress to have government health care coverage but it is denied to all others;
* that it is ok for you to have health coverage but you would deny the millions of Americans without access the right to have affordable health care;
* that it is ok that for-profit insurers can deny coverage to those with pre-existing conditions;
* that it is ok that 62% of all bankruptcies in '07 were linked to medical expenses;
Party Pooper says:
Thanks R…. I know he’s nuts but it’s fun making him research all his dumb answers
List of things Conservatives think are quite OK
“that it is ok that the USA ranks 44th in infant mortality, 50th in life expectancy;
* that it is ok to spend $6,714 per person for health care while France, Sweden, Spain, Switzerland & Britain spend on average $3,500 per person and receive a higher standard of care;
* that it is ok that in the last eight years insurance premiums have risen 78% & wages rose 19%;
* that it is ok for American Health Care to be based on reaction to illness, not prevention and early detection;
* that it is ok for those 65 and older, veterans and members of Congress to have government health care coverage but it is denied to all others;
* that it is ok for you to have health coverage but you would deny the millions of Americans without access the right to have affordable health care;
* that it is ok that for-profit insurers can deny coverage to those with pre-existing conditions;
* that it is ok that 62% of all bankruptcies in '07 were linked to medical expenses;”
OK asshole, prove that Conservatives think your points are acceptable. Just one little item of proof for a change.
I knew Shortass couldn’t stay away, lol
Steerpike says:
And we’re still waiting for definitions of “modern liberal”, “Classical Liberal” and “Elitist” from other arguments……”
See how stupid leftwing loonies are. You tell them where it is at and they still can’t find it.
Well,well, well. So now we’re “assholes”… such class this Kennebunkport Kenny has
“OK asshole, prove that Conservatives think your points are acceptable”
a) there not MY points… they’re research findings. You know, “Research”… that’s where “elitist” professors use er Science to get “facts”
b) because they’re trying to “Conserve” the status quo and these statistics (elitist statistics) describe the status quo.
QED
Well, I don’t really care that the USA ranks 44th in infant mortality, 50th in life expectancy because I’m not an infant and we’ve all gotta go sometime. It’s OK with me that we Americans spend $6,714 each for health care while France, Sweden, Spain, Switzerland & Britain spend on average $3,500 per person and receive a higher standard of care because I’ve grown used to being ripped off by Big Business and well, I’m kind of dumb and we live in a democracy so what can we do about it if Big Business is robbing us blind for a second-rate product? Look at the cars Detroit have been fooling us into buying for years!!!
And so what if in the last eight years insurance premiums have risen 78% & wages rose 19%? We Americans are used to paying through the nose and getting ripped off. I can tough it out. I ain’t no whiner.
So those 65 and older, veterans and members of Congress have government health care coverage but it is denied to all others – Big Deal!!! Maybe they’re an ELITE! And of course it’s OK for one person to have health coverage and millions of others not!!! This is AMERICA f’Chrissake!! If they can’t afford it – to Hell with them! They shudda got a better job! It’s sure as hell OK that insurers can deny coverage to those with pre-existing conditions -what do you think they are, insurance companies??? As for the losers in the 62% of all bankruptcies in '07 were linked to medical expenses – they shudda worked harder or eaten fresh fish and veggies and they were so dumb, they got sick!!! Sheeeeeesh!
…
Party Pooper says:
Well,well, well. So now we’re “assholes”… such class this Kennebunkport Kenny has”
More then you, or your friends, with your smears, and lies.
“a) there not MY points… they’re research findings. You know, “Research”… that’s where “elitist” professors use er Science to get “facts””
Can you prove any of them aere accurate?
“b) because they’re trying to “Conserve” the status quo and these statistics (elitist statistics) describe the status quo.”
See how you “debate”? I asked you to prove your comment, and all you come up with is more of the leftwing loonie talking points.
Are you trying to say, in spite of all the evidence, and facts, that the Republicans, or Conservatives, have not offered any programs that could reform the system without putting the country into trillions more debt?
Hey, tell me how good the Oregon Health Plan is working?
“See how you “debate”? I asked you to prove your comment, and all you come up with is more of the leftwing loonie talking points.
Are you trying to say, in spite of all the evidence, and facts, that the Republicans, or Conservatives, have not offered any programs that could reform the system without putting the country into trillions more debt?
Hey, tell me how good the Oregon Health Plan is working”
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Pooper says:
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz”
Braindead I see.